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It may be unpopular but.... Options
Gronk1
Posted: Monday, May 25, 2009 9:35:37 PM
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It would appear from reading a number of threads (and this crops up year after year) that one of the main bug bears for people is those who abuse rather than use alcohol at the Fest. The simple solution would be to make the fest a dry one and see what difference it makes. Before any holier than thou's start to jump up and down I am a drinker However, I could live without a beer/wine/spirit to see quality music in an atmosphere appropriate for it. It is simply an observation from my own visits to Bluesfest (starting back in 2000) that long days plus too much booze equals unpleasantness for all concerned. Yes it is an Australian right to enjoy an alcoholic drink - I've already stated I enjoy that right; but, I also respect the rights of others to listen to fantastic music without me drunkenly crapping on to my mates over the phone, I respect the rights of others not to have to walk through my semi digested wood fired pizza and 10 cans of Bundy and cola and I also respect that other people have shelled out a crapload of cash to enjoy themselves THE SAME AS ME. If that means I put a lid on my stubby for the fest then so be it.
Perhaps this may discourage some of the "here for the beer" crowd and encourage the punters who are there for the music - after all isn't that what Bluesfest is all about?

As a wise man once said to me "alcohol causes more problems than it solves"

I open the floor to those who oppose (or hopefully those that can see that I'm not a whinger but offering a solution to what is obviously becoming a problem.)
Gronk1
Posted: Monday, May 25, 2009 9:45:55 PM
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By the way despite my "newbie" status I've been on and off the forum for years - I await the replies ;)
finleym
Posted: Monday, May 25, 2009 9:49:07 PM

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Children should be educated and instructed in the principles of freedom.
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Trumpet bells ringing
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Gronk1
Posted: Monday, May 25, 2009 10:09:06 PM
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Unfortunately the operative word in that sentence is should - may we all wish for a better and nicer world for tomorrow.
HowlinBindog
Posted: Tuesday, May 26, 2009 12:22:15 AM
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Oh my god

People were drunk

Thats TERRIBLE

What ever will become of us

Oh the horror!!

We're turning into America
Gronk1
Posted: Tuesday, May 26, 2009 7:59:55 AM
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Hey Bindog, good to see you are still sniffin' around :) It's not that people were drunk, it's that people were too drunk. You and I are old enough and have enough hangovers under our belts to know when enough is enough (well I ususally do...) the comment here though is that a majority of the complaints levelled at the fetivals organisers seem to be related to behaviour and the reasons for that behaviour. I'll outline a few common threads here:
- underage drinkers
- loud and obnoxious drunks
- people who have had too much interfering with the enjoyment of the music

The suggestion I made wasn't that we have a nanny state with security making us blow into a bag before we come in - it was simply that as the majority of people who are saying they are dissatisfied claim that alcohol is a major contributor to their dissatisfaction then maybe we remove the cause. The music is still there, the food, the stalls and the great Byron vibe is still there. Also if it were advertised as a dry event maybe many of the MOJJJO crowd might decide to spend their parents hard earned at other gigs. Don't read that as an "anti yoof" comment either, I know at least a dozen under 20's who would kill to get to Byron for the fest and they wouldn't be the ones mentioned in the points above. All in all though doesn't the question at least bear a little scrutiny?
richo
Posted: Tuesday, May 26, 2009 12:41:12 PM
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Tell you what... during the 'dry' Monday at Bluesfest this year I found there were just as many tools around as any other day of the festival. Never enough to impact on my ability to enjoy myself on the whole, but still definitely there.

Then there's the business aspects... there'd be hundreds of thousands riding on alcohol sales. Advertising it as a dry event might do very well to scare away a portion of the 'Mojo' crowd, but where do you think the festival makes its profits? The organisers have stated many times over the years that attracting this crowd and their disposable income is vital to the viability of the festival. We wouldn't see a fraction of the amazing artists we do if it weren't for this segment of the crowd. Plus I'd wager that any alleged alcohol-fueled behaviour issues are far from restricted to those in attendance to see Mojo acts.
HowlinBindog
Posted: Tuesday, May 26, 2009 1:49:39 PM
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But it sounds exactly like the old Nanny state attitude Gronk1


Everytime I went to the bar, I witnessed security quietly and efficiently asking to inspect ID. I spend my time between Jambalaya and Crossroads and rarely venture much further. Didn't witness all that many people who appeared to be underage and drunk and saw less drunk people at the fest than I did 5, 10 and 15 yrs ago

I did see ONE girl who had been picked up by security for being intoxicated and underage and she was being assisted by both security and police in a kind and caring fashion

If you're offended by people enjoying themselves in an earthy, indeed bluesy way then go to an entertainment centre somewhere. There you'll pay high prices and stand in line for ages, sit in airconditioned comfort and if somebody offends you by acting in a way you personally find offensive, (like dancing or standing up) security will be only to happy to eject them on your behalf.

For years the bars at bluesfest were run as a fundrasier for the local footy club. Regardless if it still is or not, tis an important part of the business of making the festival a success

Purchase of a ticket at an event like this should not give you the expectation that your enjoyment of the festival is not something you need to work at

You need to plan how you approach it and this includes how you interact with the festival, the punters, the bars, the toilets, the PA's, security, the pooches, the people who are intoxicated, the rain etc etc etc

People who complain about the people around them enjoying themselves more boisterously than they'd like sound like the type of people who would fill the Jambalaya to the brim with chairs for Ruthie Foster, making it IMPOSSIBLE for anybody else to get in the tent

The only two gigs I wanted to see and couldn't were Ruthie and Tim Finn at jambalaya. I couldn't get in to the tent because of the chairs and the people who'd decided that it was their right to monopolize those gigs

I was far more offended by that than the kids running around having the time of their lives

I HAVENT forgotten what that was like

The Temperance League would appear to be alive and well

"I'LL TESTIFY!!"
zyfert
Posted: Tuesday, May 26, 2009 2:24:01 PM
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HowlinBindog wrote:
People who complain about the people around them enjoying themselves more boisterously than they'd like sound like the type of people who would fill the Jambalaya to the brim with chairs for Ruthie Foster, making it IMPOSSIBLE for anybody else to get in the tent
The only two gigs I wanted to see and couldn't were Ruthie and Tim Finn at jambalaya. I couldn't get in to the tent because of the chairs and the people who'd decided that it was their right to monopolize those gigs
I was far more offended by that than the kids running around having the time of their lives


Too true, have a look at the images below for those who weren't there, makes one want to re-open the 'chairs' thread:



http://www.youtube.com/user/Zyfert

Z

c0kebloke
Posted: Tuesday, May 26, 2009 2:32:14 PM
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Punish all for the actions of the minority?no thanks!
Dan...
Posted: Tuesday, May 26, 2009 3:39:15 PM
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yeah i had to stand in the rain for tony joe because of the chairs. i still had a ball because i'm such a huge fan, but it really shouldn't be like that.

i've never complained about chairs in the past but if i'm going to continue respecting the people who bring them (a respect i have shown for 9 years now) i'd like them to respect me.

the only real run in i had with a drunk was when one threw mud at me when i was wearing my dragons jersey, but i kind of expected it.

The poster formerly known as Dan
zyfert
Posted: Tuesday, May 26, 2009 6:45:15 PM
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I don't get why they put the grandstand seating into Jambalaya this year.
It worked really well last year at the back of Crossroads with the video screen etc.
Jambalaya is too small to have all that seating.
waffles
Posted: Wednesday, May 27, 2009 6:30:41 PM
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most of the chairs were at the BACK of jambalaya,where hopefully,they should be.
its just that the main entrance to the tent was at the back.the side entrances did not get used that much.

re the alcohol.i have it on reasonable authority that the GREAT NORTHERN HOTEL held the liquor licence for bluesfest. if the responsibility for policing control belonged to them,i dont know,but it might explain some problems that were out of bluesfest control.

I don't want to hang up my rock n roll shoes
I get a good time feeling every time I hear those blues.
RaucousReg
Posted: Wednesday, May 27, 2009 10:03:26 PM

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waffles wrote:
most of the chairs were at the BACK of jambalaya,where hopefully,they should be.




Photo was taken from the second or third row from the rail looking BACK to the mix and the exit. If most of the chairs are at the back then it was only because there was more room to put them. This was a disgrace.

namaste
RR
HowlinBindog
Posted: Wednesday, May 27, 2009 11:05:15 PM
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waffles wrote:
most of the chairs were at the BACK of jambalaya,where hopefully,they should be.
its just that the main entrance to the tent was at the back.the side entrances did not get used that much.



Not the way I saw it Waffles

I tried all the ways in to the tent at Ruthie's gig and it was absolutely impenetrable 10 mins before she went on and stayed that way until Tim Finn finished

That was the most blatant example of "efuceekay everybody else, I'll look after myself" Ive seen at bluesfest and it seemed to be perpetrated by a majority of people 40 plus

Chairs take up the room that could be utilised by other people wanting to see the act and at those two gigs, probably halved the amount of people able to get inside the tent

Selfish behaviour by people who should be old enough to know better and the best possible reason to ban chairs altogether
Gronk1
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2009 7:54:59 AM
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These last few relpies have added to the point that this thread was hopefully trying to make - there's always going to be something in an enclosed space with x thousand people there that gets on your nerves.
We all come from different backgrounds with different tolerance levels and whether it be booze, chairs, mobiles, cameras, weather or hygiene levels you will get annoyed by something at some point. I broached this topic knowing I would cop flack and so far I would like to thank those who have replied for being honest and polite in their responses - I hope I have replied in the same manner :)
I guess I was just trying to crystallise some common complaints and find one common cause - I don't necessarily agree with an alcohol ban but I thought it would be an interesting topic and one that hadn't been discussed to death before - like chairs, weather, Mojjjo etc
I do agree with HowlinBindog that you need to plan your days if you are going to stay the course of a 5 day pass, that's one of the benefits of being a multiple Bluesfest veteran - you know what to expect.
I'm happy for this thread to keep going but I think as we can see it's starting to run its course and get sidetracked already - best wishes and if I see you at the fest we'll have "one bourbon, one scotch and one beer"
RaucousReg
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2009 8:03:50 AM

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HowlinBindog wrote:
waffles wrote:
most of the chairs were at the BACK of jambalaya,where hopefully,they should be.
its just that the main entrance to the tent was at the back.the side entrances did not get used that much.



Not the way I saw it Waffles

I tried all the ways in to the tent at Ruthie's gig and it was absolutely impenetrable 10 mins before she went on and stayed that way until Tim Finn finished

That was the most blatant example of "efuceekay everybody else, I'll look after myself" Ive seen at bluesfest and it seemed to be perpetrated by a majority of people 40 plus

Chairs take up the room that could be utilised by other people wanting to see the act and at those two gigs, probably halved the amount of people able to get inside the tent

Selfish behaviour by people who should be old enough to know better and the best possible reason to ban chairs altogether


Bindog,

FYI the photo I posted was at Ruthie's gig!

namaste
RR
HowlinBindog
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2009 8:57:34 AM
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Gronk1 wrote:
best wishes and if I see you at the fest we'll have "one bourbon, one scotch and one beer"


Hell no

Lets have 10

;)

No worries Gronk1

Sure beats discussing who we want to see next year in 13 different threads
ScottM
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2009 12:11:51 PM
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HowlinBindog wrote:
waffles wrote:
most of the chairs were at the BACK of jambalaya,where hopefully,they should be.
its just that the main entrance to the tent was at the back.the side entrances did not get used that much.



Not the way I saw it Waffles

I tried all the ways in to the tent at Ruthie's gig and it was absolutely impenetrable 10 mins before she went on and stayed that way until Tim Finn finished

That was the most blatant example of "efuceekay everybody else, I'll look after myself" Ive seen at bluesfest and it seemed to be perpetrated by a majority of people 40 plus

Chairs take up the room that could be utilised by other people wanting to see the act and at those two gigs, probably halved the amount of people able to get inside the tent

Selfish behaviour by people who should be old enough to know better and the best possible reason to ban chairs altogether



Why not just make it a bigger tent? Jambalaya was where the most obvious overcrowding issues occurred, which coincided with the tiered "bleachers" being moved in this year and taking up a lot of the internal space. They probably aren't the most efficient set up, in a person per square metre sense. Last year, the crowd happily spilled out the sides of the tent and everybody managed a view of some sort.

And let's not forget, tromping around in mud all day can get a little tiresome - I was thankful to be able to sit in a chair, whereas I may have happily settled for some dry ground in more forgiving circumstances.

As for the main subject - an alcohol ban would just be too far against my own self interest for me to support it :-) There are different generational attitudes to alcohol consumption, and they are replicated in a festival environment such as this. Pretty tough to fix.
youngbill
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2009 3:55:54 PM
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Well it's about time someone came in and made everything ok so here I am!

In tribute to the lone stranger I'll just go for a stream of consciousness with some sort of order and see if anything remotely sensible comes of it. You never know.

1. How about chairs, beach shelters, pogo sticks etc in the environs of the mixing desk, with some physical delinitation suggesting chair areas?
2. How about maybe painting the ground (it will at least last for the first day so people might get the idea), some sort of light plasticy non injuring markers / barriers?
3. How about some volunteers doing some suggestive (but certainly not lewd!) styled ushering gently guiding the chair bears in the right direction?
4. How about a tag team of a tired and slightly cranky Chris Wilson & Hat Fitz going around berating people for putting their chairs in the wrong spot? Both entertaining and effective!
5. How about space for aisles vaguely indicated so chairs in the zone are maybe slightly orderly (for easier entry and exit) rather than looking like they'd had been placed according to a print out from a random messy crap generator that had been mistakenly read upside down?
6. (still working on 6.)
7. How about a chairs only rule, so everyone has to carry and use chairs, unless walking from their chair to another they've previously set in another tent?
8. How about chairs at the front as logic would suggest the standing person is taller than the sitting person?
9. How about less people in each tent? Mathematically, if there were less people there would be more room.
10. How about chair days and non chair days, as per odds and evens days for petrol rationing in the early 80's?
11. How about all chairs one year, no chairs the next year?
12. How about just getting over it?
13. Too unlucky to consider a how about for this one.
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