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Don’t bow to the pressure Options
regards
Posted: Thursday, August 09, 2018 9:48:27 AM
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mccin0000 wrote:
At this present moment in time the biggest tours currently in Australia are Katy Perry, Pink and Celine Dion. Let’s call a spade a spade, all this rubbish is simply fake news, full stop. If people want to see you - they will pay to see you regardless of sex or orientation.


Agree.

But this crap has created a lot of free publicity for BluesFest.

And I am thinking that a lot more people know about the initial line up than normally would.

So as such, this extra attention may not end up being a bad thing.
skot20_58
Posted: Thursday, August 09, 2018 10:12:02 AM
Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 10/26/2008
Posts: 976
Points: -810
regards wrote:
mccin0000 wrote:
At this present moment in time the biggest tours currently in Australia are Katy Perry, Pink and Celine Dion. Let’s call a spade a spade, all this rubbish is simply fake news, full stop. If people want to see you - they will pay to see you regardless of sex or orientation.


Agree.

But this crap has created a lot of free publicity for BluesFest.

And I am thinking that a lot more people know about the initial line up than normally would.

So as such, this extra attention may not end up being a bad thing.




100%


Dear Skot,
Are you going to be a goose all your life?
mpember
Posted: Thursday, August 09, 2018 12:56:28 PM

Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 11/16/2008
Posts: 554
Points: -78
skot20_58 wrote:
Leave Bluesfest alone leave it how it is.


In continuing that logic, should BF close down the "future artists" section of this forum? If the response to commentary about artists being excluded from announcements is to tell the author to "f off", it is only fair that the same response be given to anyone who dares to comment about names missing from the current list of announced artists.

That would require no further mention of Mr. Vedder. No more wishlists.

You must limit discussion only to the contents of the announced artists. Anything else would be a show of disrespect to Mr Noble and the team behind BF. The very suggestion that artists may have been overlooked by BF administration is an insult to their hard work and dedication.

Anyone who thinks a particular artist should be included needs to get out there and start their own touring company.

glenboss wrote:
As far as I’m concerned Peter Noble and the team at Bluesfest have always showed an honorable decent and upfront attitude


I suspect the nazi comments fall short of such a description. Even Mr Noble admits the error of making such a comment.

skot20_58 wrote:
Seems a bit strange they are wanting to play a sausage fest run by sausages.


It would appear that artist input is treated on a case-by-case basis by many in this forum. When artists requested later start times, some got upset about the reduced hours of music. But in this case you dismiss artist input.

skot20_58 wrote:
I will take a few words from your response.


And you appear to have misinterpreted the very small segment that you chose to reference. You appear to have gotten the cause and effect mixed up. You appear to have suggested that the decision to create festivals or tour on their own is a response to the most recent line-up announcement.

Dallas Frasca's Hitch In The Sticks started last year. It had been 12 months in development. Jen Cloher has appeared at BF previously.

It is quite possible that the number of female acts touring on their own in recent years is as a result of the way tours and festivals have been booked over the last decade. And the result appears to be that festivals are faced with a decision. They can either continue with their 'meritocracy' and 'availability of talent' arguments, cherry-picking from a glut of male artists, or their could foster the female talent which is overlooked by many in the industry.

Just imagine if Bluesfest decided to disband the 'Boomerang' promotion. Would calls for indigenous inclusion be met with the same vitriolic response some have shown towards those who dare to comment about the lack of gender diversity in the latest announcement? Would the inclusion of Dan Sultan (iirc, the only indigenous artist not to be relegated to the first few time slots of the day) be consideration enough to dismiss any negative commentary?
skot20_58
Posted: Thursday, August 09, 2018 1:16:18 PM
Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 10/26/2008
Posts: 976
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mpember wrote:
skot20_58 wrote:
Leave Bluesfest alone leave it how it is.


In continuing that logic, should BF close down the "future artists" section of this forum? If the response to commentary about artists being excluded from announcements is to tell the author to "f off", it is only fair that the same response be given to anyone who dares to comment about names missing from the current list of announced artists.

That would require no further mention of Mr. Vedder. No more wishlists.

You must limit discussion only to the contents of the announced artists. Anything else would be a show of disrespect to Mr Noble and the team behind BF. The very suggestion that artists may have been overlooked by BF administration is an insult to their hard work and dedication.

Anyone who thinks a particular artist should be included needs to get out there and start their own touring company.

glenboss wrote:
As far as I’m concerned Peter Noble and the team at Bluesfest have always showed an honorable decent and upfront attitude


I suspect the nazi comments fall short of such a description. Even Mr Noble admits the error of making such a comment.

skot20_58 wrote:
Seems a bit strange they are wanting to play a sausage fest run by sausages.


It would appear that artist input is treated on a case-by-case basis by many in this forum. When artists requested later start times, some got upset about the reduced hours of music. But in this case you dismiss artist input.

skot20_58 wrote:
I will take a few words from your response.


And you appear to have misinterpreted the very small segment that you chose to reference. You appear to have gotten the cause and effect mixed up. You appear to have suggested that the decision to create festivals or tour on their own is a response to the most recent line-up announcement.

Dallas Frasca's Hitch In The Sticks started last year. It had been 12 months in development. Jen Cloher has appeared at BF previously.

It is quite possible that the number of female acts touring on their own in recent years is as a result of the way tours and festivals have been booked over the last decade. And the result appears to be that festivals are faced with a decision. They can either continue with their 'meritocracy' and 'availability of talent' arguments, cherry-picking from a glut of male artists, or their could foster the female talent which is overlooked by many in the industry.

Just imagine if Bluesfest decided to disband the 'Boomerang' promotion. Would calls for indigenous inclusion be met with the same vitriolic response some have shown towards those who dare to comment about the lack of gender diversity in the latest announcement? Would the inclusion of Dan Sultan (iirc, the only indigenous artist not to be relegated to the first few time slots of the day) be consideration enough to dismiss any negative commentary?


And you appear to have misinterpreted


Dear Skot,
Are you going to be a goose all your life?
glenboss
Posted: Thursday, August 09, 2018 2:16:55 PM
Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 9/9/2011
Posts: 572
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Dear mpember,

I stand corrected. If it will make you feel any better I would be content to replace the word "always" with the words "in the vast majority of instances that I am aware of". Happy ??

Regards Glenboss

andrewfuller620000
Posted: Thursday, August 09, 2018 2:22:07 PM

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Posts: 175
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Location: Hobart, Tasmania
I have to say that talent is talent, regardless of sex, race, creed, class, religion, left-handedness/right-handedness, beauty......etc, etc.....

So long as the most readily-available, and viable talent is booked, then the vast majority of punters will be perfectly happy.
Bluesfest is an institution now, and in the majority of instances, gets it pretty right.
Perhaps some of the most outspoken whingers and naysayers need to take a good, long hard look at themselves, rather than off-loading on everybody else.


"The white man had the schmaltz
The black man had the blues
No one knew what they was gonna do
But Tchaikovsky had the news...."
greybeard
Posted: Thursday, August 09, 2018 4:45:37 PM

Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 10/17/2008
Posts: 1,605
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Location: Sydney Northern Beaches


Quote:
mpember
Posted: Thursday, 9 August 2018 12:56:28 PM

skot20_58 wrote:
Leave Bluesfest alone leave it how it is.


mpmember thank you for using the dialog box correctly in your post starting with the above post mark.

Boxes with large amount of redundant text inside boxes, inside further boxes is nothing but an eyesore, confusing and off putting
Please people, I don't what to get cranky and have to use capitals !!


Heading out for the East Coast / Lord knows I've paid some dues gettin' through, / Tangled up in blues.
skot20_58
Posted: Thursday, August 09, 2018 7:41:58 PM
Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 10/26/2008
Posts: 976
Points: -810
greybeard wrote:


Quote:
mpember
Posted: Thursday, 9 August 2018 12:56:28 PM

skot20_58 wrote:
Leave Bluesfest alone leave it how it is.


mpmember thank you for using the dialog box correctly in your post starting with the above post mark.

Boxes with large amount of redundant text inside boxes, inside further boxes is nothing but an eyesore, confusing and off putting
Please people, I don't what to get cranky and have to use capitals !!



👍


Dear Skot,
Are you going to be a goose all your life?
eileenk9
Posted: Friday, August 10, 2018 9:16:45 AM

Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 2/24/2011
Posts: 1,076
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I'll speak about Mr Vedder as much as I want thanks, mpmember. Why are you singling him out anyway? There are numerous other artists who have never played at Bluesfest before that people keep asking for year after year.

ps. "no more wishlists" was that meant to a pun?

pss. Wishlist is the title of a Pearl Jam song

Speak to the hand
mpember
Posted: Friday, August 10, 2018 11:59:09 AM

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Joined: 11/16/2008
Posts: 554
Points: -78
eileenk9 wrote:
I'll speak about Mr Vedder as much as I want thanks


I take no issue with your ongoing campaign. I referenced your eternal struggle only to demonstrate that many see fit to pass comment about gaps that they think exist in the line-up of any announcement from BF. Many even see fit to pass judgement about festivals that they don't attend. Whether it is a swipe at Splendour, or a comment about the audience at Falls, this forum is not short of people who appoint themselves the adjudicator of 'good taste'.

eileenk9 wrote:
ps. "no more wishlists" was that meant to a pun?


If I was to say it was intentional, I would be telling a lie. It was a reference to the ongoing thread of lists which forum members use as a method of correcting the perceived errors of artist selection that are being made, even it is is only an error of omission.

greybeard wrote:
mpmember thank you for using the dialog box correctly


https://youtu.be/XUwUp-D_VV0

While I appreciate your comment, should I make anything of your incorrect spelling of my username? ;)

andrewfuller620000 wrote:
So long as the most readily-available, and viable talent is booked, then the vast majority of punters will be perfectly happy.


The problem with the 'meritocracy' argument is that it overlooks the existing biases in the system/industry. If BF was a meritocracy, the Boomerang branding would not exist. The small detail that a stand-alone festival, focused on indigenous artists, was not maintained as a standalone event would be grounds for abandoning the brand.

Instead, a decision was made to incorporate it into the larger commercial operation of BF. The wider appeal of BF is being used to draw the crowds' attention to a segment of the industry / music community that may otherwise draw a niche crowd.

Noble's response suggested that the lack of female representation in the 2019 line-up was a result of not being approached by female acts. But every hype-laden, pre-announcement email appears to suggest BF spend their waking hours chasing elusive artists that were otherwise unwilling/unable to appear at the festival in previous years.

regards wrote:
But this crap has created a lot of free publicity for BluesFest.


It got them a mention in the Betoota Advocate.
skot20_58
Posted: Friday, August 10, 2018 12:07:02 PM
Rank: Advanced Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 10/26/2008
Posts: 976
Points: -810
mpember wrote:
eileenk9 wrote:
I'll speak about Mr Vedder as much as I want thanks


I take no issue with your ongoing campaign. I referenced your eternal struggle only to demonstrate that many see fit to pass comment about gaps that they think exist in the line-up of any announcement from BF. Many even see fit to pass judgement about festivals that they don't attend. Whether it is a swipe at Splendour, or a comment about the audience at Falls, this forum is not short of people who appoint themselves the adjudicator of 'good taste'.

eileenk9 wrote:
ps. "no more wishlists" was that meant to a pun?


If I was to say it was intentional, I would be telling a lie. It was a reference to the ongoing thread of lists which forum members use as a method of correcting the perceived errors of artist selection that are being made, even it is is only an error of omission.

greybeard wrote:
mpmember thank you for using the dialog box correctly


https://youtu.be/XUwUp-D_VV0

While I appreciate your comment, should I make anything of your incorrect spelling of my username? ;)

andrewfuller620000 wrote:
So long as the most readily-available, and viable talent is booked, then the vast majority of punters will be perfectly happy.


The problem with the 'meritocracy' argument is that it overlooks the existing biases in the system/industry. If BF was a meritocracy, the Boomerang branding would not exist. The small detail that a stand-alone festival, focused on indigenous artists, was not maintained as a standalone event would be grounds for abandoning the brand.

Instead, a decision was made to incorporate it into the larger commercial operation of BF. The wider appeal of BF is being used to draw the crowds' attention to a segment of the industry / music community that may otherwise draw a niche crowd.

Noble's response suggested that the lack of female representation in the 2019 line-up was a result of not being approached by female acts. But every hype-laden, pre-announcement email appears to suggest BF spend their waking hours chasing elusive artists that were otherwise unwilling/unable to appear at the festival in previous years.

regards wrote:
But this crap has created a lot of free publicity for BluesFest.


It got them a mention in the Betoota Advocate.




👍


Dear Skot,
Are you going to be a goose all your life?
TheLoneRanger
Posted: Friday, August 10, 2018 6:58:18 PM
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Joined: 10/19/2008
Posts: 3,851
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Location: 46* South
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-07/bluesfest-apologises-over-social-media-nazi-slur/10083460
We have only once seen the theatre tent at Bluesfest...2009.
I would suggest that the return of that tent is what Simone is suggesting.
I thoroughly enjoyed that tent.
https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/nsw/simone-genziuk-is-one-of-the-stars-of-this-years-royal-easter-show-not-surprising-when-you-see-her-lift-a-75kg-washing-machine-with-her-hair/news-story/8627880f3dfa1574b8452de70aa2bc39

"An artist never really chooses when and where they will play.It is for promoters to make offers.It comes down as to whether tours are financially viable." Quote John Mayall.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbEHzqildp8
andrewfuller620000
Posted: Friday, August 10, 2018 8:26:23 PM

Rank: Advanced Member
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Location: Hobart, Tasmania
Somebody seems to need the last word on everything.

"The white man had the schmaltz
The black man had the blues
No one knew what they was gonna do
But Tchaikovsky had the news...."
skot20_58
Posted: Saturday, August 11, 2018 6:14:05 AM
Rank: Advanced Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 10/26/2008
Posts: 976
Points: -810
andrewfuller620000 wrote:
Somebody seems to need the last word on everything.





👍


Dear Skot,
Are you going to be a goose all your life?
c0kebloke
Posted: Monday, August 20, 2018 1:17:51 AM
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Joined: 9/23/2011
Posts: 888
Points: -4,459
Location: Struggletown
Seems the Sunday telegraph have now jumped on the bandwagon - https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/rendezview/our-music-industry-is-a-sexist-mess-time-for-a-reality-check/news-story/22e0678071cae19d65162261a601dfe6

The article I read in the paper was even more hardline than this & even had a fake festival poster with only female artists on the bill & yet if someone were to do the same but had only males on offer what would the reaction be?
They highlighted bf as one main offender.
I’ve noticed over the years bf have made efforts to showcase some great female artists both well known & newer artists.
If it were not for bf I would never of got the chance to see some great female artists like Patti Smith mavis staples & Bonnie Raitt to name just a few.
Plus I’d never of heard of Ruthie Foster or Nikki Hill The only artist I bothered to see twice in the one year at bf.
Ignore the critics & keep doing what you do so well in regard to the great music on offer @ bf be it male or female artists.


They got the cocaine, oxycontin, mushrooms, marijuana
Vodka, plastic pop-off, twist one off
Yesterday I smoked, today I don't
Yeah, yeah, yeah


The Ike Reilly Assassination:Valentine's Day In Juárez
mpember
Posted: Monday, August 20, 2018 5:33:45 PM

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Joined: 11/16/2008
Posts: 554
Points: -78
c0kebloke wrote:
They highlighted bf as one main offender.


The link you posted makes no mention of BF.

c0kebloke wrote:
Seems the Sunday telegraph have now jumped on the bandwagon


The content writes itself and generates clicks. Have you ever seen a social media campaign that didn't get covered in The Daily Telegraph?

c0kebloke wrote:
even had a fake festival poster with only female artists on the bill


That is a common technique of highlighting under-representation. I'm sure some on this forum could use a similar technique to highlight the lack of old white guys who haven't released a new song in 30 years.
skot20_58
Posted: Monday, August 20, 2018 6:27:55 PM
Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 10/26/2008
Posts: 976
Points: -810
mpember wrote:
c0kebloke wrote:
They highlighted bf as one main offender.


The link you posted makes no mention of BF.

c0kebloke wrote:
Seems the Sunday telegraph have now jumped on the bandwagon


The content writes itself and generates clicks. Have you ever seen a social media campaign that didn't get covered in The Daily Telegraph?

c0kebloke wrote:
even had a fake festival poster with only female artists on the bill


That is a common technique of highlighting under-representation. I'm sure some on this forum could use a similar technique to highlight the lack of old white guys who haven't released a new song in 30 years.




👎


Dear Skot,
Are you going to be a goose all your life?
c0kebloke
Posted: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 8:30:37 PM
Rank: Advanced Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 9/23/2011
Posts: 888
Points: -4,459
Location: Struggletown
skot20_58 wrote:
mpember wrote:
c0kebloke wrote:
They highlighted bf as one main offender.


The link you posted makes no mention of BF.

c0kebloke wrote:
Seems the Sunday telegraph have now jumped on the bandwagon


The content writes itself and generates clicks. Have you ever seen a social media campaign that didn't get covered in The Daily Telegraph?

c0kebloke wrote:
even had a fake festival poster with only female artists on the bill


That is a common technique of highlighting under-representation. I'm sure some on this forum could use a similar technique to highlight the lack of old white guys who haven't released a new song in 30 years.




👎

1. I made sure to highlight the fact that the printed version was more hardline than the online link.…you still seem to be having trouble keeping up with what’s been posted.

2. Stating the bleeding obvious lends nothing to the conversation.
The more press that put this rubbish out the more some will believe it

3. I’m sure that’s true but they don’t & for obvious reasons that being common sense as after all if this sort of thinking gains more momentum what next?
Not enough Biromantic Demisexuals
Not enough albino artists
Not enough disabled artists?

It’s all just getting a little ridiculous in my view.



They got the cocaine, oxycontin, mushrooms, marijuana
Vodka, plastic pop-off, twist one off
Yesterday I smoked, today I don't
Yeah, yeah, yeah


The Ike Reilly Assassination:Valentine's Day In Juárez
mpember
Posted: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 10:59:33 PM

Rank: Advanced Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 11/16/2008
Posts: 554
Points: -78
c0kebloke wrote:
The more press that put this rubbish out the more some will believe it

You were the one who dug up an article from three weeks ago, not the newspaper.

c0kebloke wrote:
I’m sure that’s true but they don’t & for obvious reasons that being common sense as after all if this sort of thinking gains more momentum what next?

The next step is that it will no longer be possible to generate a festival poster where almost every act is male. It may mean that bluesfest chooses to distribute the non-male acts throughout their announcement schedule, to avoid a 'sausage fest' accusation. If the gender representation is as diverse as BF (and those on this forum) say, it shouldn't be hard to have each announcement better reflect the overall diversity of the full line-up.

If anything, it will reduce the risk of a twitter jibe resulting in a sleep-deprived rant that references Nazis.

c0kebloke wrote:
It’s all just getting a little ridiculous in my view.

It is odd to resurrect an old article, on a forum topic which had been silent for over a week, only to decry the continued discussion. Do you not see the irony in such an action?
skot20_58
Posted: Wednesday, August 22, 2018 5:16:49 AM
Rank: Advanced Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 10/26/2008
Posts: 976
Points: -810
mpember wrote:
c0kebloke wrote:
The more press that put this rubbish out the more some will believe it

You were the one who dug up an article from three weeks ago, not the newspaper.

c0kebloke wrote:
I’m sure that’s true but they don’t & for obvious reasons that being common sense as after all if this sort of thinking gains more momentum what next?

The next step is that it will no longer be possible to generate a festival poster where almost every act is male. It may mean that bluesfest chooses to distribute the non-male acts throughout their announcement schedule, to avoid a 'sausage fest' accusation. If the gender representation is as diverse as BF (and those on this forum) say, it shouldn't be hard to have each announcement better reflect the overall diversity of the full line-up.

If anything, it will reduce the risk of a twitter jibe resulting in a sleep-deprived rant that references Nazis.

c0kebloke wrote:
It’s all just getting a little ridiculous in my view.

It is odd to resurrect an old article, on a forum topic which had been silent for over a week, only to decry the continued discussion. Do you not see the irony in such an action?



🤚🏿👈🙏👎👎


Dear Skot,
Are you going to be a goose all your life?
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